You'll ruin sensors and have nothing to show for it. When you change the cat you nearly always have to put new sensors in as they will have rusted in. A switching voltage on the post-cat sensor indicates that the gases are passing across the catalytic converter's ceramic monolith without being subjected to chemical change and therefore the cat requires replacing with a known good unit, providing that the pre-cat waveform is within specification. The ECU wont be able to adjust fuel trims properly. You just need to get one precat O2 sensor. Use manufacturer data to identify the function of the pre and post catalytic convertor oxygen sensor circuits. Come join the discussion about Bimmerfest events, production numbers, programming, performance, modifications, classifieds, troubleshooting, maintenance, and more! This is a TSB regarding the P2096 problem. Techincally all 4 O2 sensors are the same. The difference in the amount of oxygen between that present in the outside air, and that present in the exhaust promotes the flow of oxygen ions and produces voltage. The opinions expressed on this site are not necessarily those of the Club, who shall have no liability in respect of them or the accuracy of the content. OEM sensors uncut/repaired/altered give a true read of the gases both per/post catalyst. Depending on the engine design, vehicles can have multiple oxygen sensors, sometimes on both sides of the engine. The POST-cat O2 sensors are the only ones effected. Don't do it. Switch on the oximeter and connect the applied probe to the oximeter. Our collection of training videos, articles, guides and information on training courses. The most commonly used sensor has a Zirconia element, producing a voltage when there is a difference in oxygen content between the two electrodes. Closing out this thread for the troubleshooting masses. Titania is also used in the manufacture of another type of lambda sensor that offers a faster switching time than the more common Zirconia sensor. Picture Information. Library of examples on how to perform tests when using PicoScope. The catalytic converter is where you will find the sensors. 27 sold . The upstream oxygen sensor(s) are located below the exhaust manifold flanges and above the catalytic converter. settings. What is the difference between pre cat O2 sensor and Post car O2 sensor in term of sensor wise(not. The technical storage or access that is used exclusively for statistical purposes. AU $129.99 + AU $45.00 postage . Porsche Club Great Britain gives no warranties, guarantees or assurances and makes no representations or recommendations regarding any goods or services advertised on this site. Local autozone had it in stock less than $100. O2 Oxygen Sensor Kit For Mazda CX-7 2006-2012 2.3 Turbo Petrol (both sensors) New . These Remove passenger side front Use the factory wire retainers i Both Titania and Zirconia sensors, when working correctly, switch approximately once per second (1 Hz) and will both only start to switch once the normal operating temperature has been achieved. Posts made and opinions expressed are those of the individual forum members This is due to the fact that bank 2 is representative of an engines #2 cylinder, while sensor 2 serves as a downstream designation. Sensor 1 is the sensor closest to the engine. Fantastic products and support with unbelievable performance for the money. $80.43 . Oxygen molecules from the exhaust gas pass through tiny slots or holes in the sensors steel shell to reach the sensing element, or nernst cell. The code P0420 can be caused by the catalyst, O2 sensors before and after the catalyst. A typical Zirconia lambda sensor has four wires. The voltage range, in most cases, varies between 0.2 and 0.8 volts: 0.2 volts indicates a lean mixture and 0.8 V shows a richer mixture. What to look out for in a failing O2 sensor . The technical storage or access is required to create user profiles to send advertising, or to track the user on a website or across several websites for similar marketing purposes. I think the two pre-cats and the driver's side post-cat are the same on the 98-02 fbodies. Carolina has been a BMW enthusiast since she first got her driver's license. When the oxygen sensor fails, the computer can no longer sense the air/fuel ratio, so it ends up guessing. Click the Add comment button to leave your feedback. Apply a clean and reusable pulse oximeter sensor to either foot. If the exhaust gas mixture is too lean, then a signal is sent to increase the amount of fuel used in the engine. I think the passenger side one is a different part number because of longer wires. Bank 2 Sensor 2 is the second sensor on the engine's exhaust pipe, usually behind the catalytic converter. and 399 r.w.h.p. There is no difference between the pre and post O2 sensors. Bank 2 Sensor 1 means Upstream Left/Front; Bank 1 Sensor 2 means Downstream Right/Rear; Bank 2 Sensor 2 means Downstream Left/Front. I was very impressed as to the speed and ease of ordering. If you unplug the lambda sensor it will need to default to the fuel maps that its already calculated as being good. That's where my misconfusion came from. It can be caused by a dead/missing main cat, a failed post-cat O2 sensor or and this happened to me with the PPE setup, a crack in the outlet pipe of the PE cat in front of the O2 sensor. So essentially bmw did a change to the DME which came with different sensors, the wide-band I mentioned, in 2003. Content on spyderchat.com is generated by its users. Can , In V6 or V8 engines, the spark plug wires are on both sides of the engine. Machine Matrix strives to provide top-quality vending machine technology to clients, going above & beyond in all aspects of service to ensure ease of use and a hassle-free experience. We also use third-party cookies that help us analyze and understand how you use this website. Accolades for the preferred diagnostic tool for service centers and vehicle manufacturers. A sensing element sits inside the sensor, encased in a steel housing. please help all stuff is breaking this wknd !! To protect against the sensor becoming welded into its threading, Delphi sensors come with anti-seize compounds either pre-applied or included in the box. New . Check the O2 sensor is reading correctly by confirming the O2 value with a four, or five gas emission analyser. Free shipping . Hover to zoom. $89.05 . A forum community dedicated to BMW owners and enthusiasts. Most oxygen sensors come with a special electrically conductive anti-seize compound applied to the threads, so its merely a matter of threading the new sensor into the void left by the old one. The downstream oxygen sensor detects the change and informs the vehicles computer. Our garage has checked leaks and wiring and this is what they have done. hi guys i got old 02 sensor out a Little tight getting new one in. Bank 2 Sensor 1 is the first sensor closest to the engine. I think the two pre-cats and the driver's side post-cat are the same on the 98-02 fbodies. If both O2 sensors and catalyst was replaced then you may have an exhaust leak at the manifold or pipes. Their bodies are identical, so the threads. This information is an example of our investigations and findings and is not a definitive procedure. On Bank 2 means it is at the engine side with cylinders 2, 4, 6, 8, etc. with unbelievable performance for the money. functioning wise) Also, where can I buy a cheaper O2 sensor? Could I buy universal one, if not why? Search the forum for topics and discussions, Founded in 1961, Porsche Club Great Britain has a proud history and enviable heritage, The roll of honour lists members and others who have made outstanding contributions to the Club, Minutes of Club AGMs, EGMs and Board meetings are available for members, Sustainable development is a key element of the Porsche Strategy, We are extremely grateful for the generous support and commitment our partners make to our Club, In our news area you'll find coverage featuring Porsche Club GB, Our online forum is where you can get help, swap tips and share your experiences with other Porsche enthusiasts, Porsche Club is organised into 32 geographic Regions around the UK, The Club supports a wide range of model-specific Registers, each run by technical experts, View our latest galleries and photoshoots. Free shipping . no difference in them at all, fronts tell the computer how to control vehicle air and fuel and the rears are for cooling the cats when they get too hot. $64.34 . This allows measurement of a much wider air/fuel ratio. On an oscilloscope, the resultant waveform should look as the illustration above. Contact information for direct sales and support queries, plus our network of global distributors. You never never never get anything done at the dealer, NEVERRRRRR. Copyright 2022 Machine Matrix L.L.C. Disclaimer Then use a spanner or dedicated O2 socket wrench - to unscrew the sensor from its seating. The Waveform Library is a global database of waveforms uploaded by PicoScope users. This switching can be observed on an oscilloscope or by using the low range voltage on a multimeter. This help topic is subject to changes without notification. I tried a couple of them and got codes before I even started the car. Upstream is before the Cat and downstream is after the cat. AU $309.99 + AU $45.00 postage . Is upstream pre or post cat? Are the sensors indeed the same functionally? How do you fix P0420 catalyst system efficiency Below Threshold Bank 1? do i have to lower exhaust pipe ? This signal is then sent to the Electronic Control Module (ECM) and the mixture is adjusted accordingly. It does not store any personal data. If the exhaust gas mixture is too rich and there is too little oxygen in the exhaust, a signal is sent to the engines Electronic Control Unit (ECU) to decrease the amount of fuel added into the cylinder. i.e. Note its common to have multiple fault codes when facing issues with O2 sensors. Expecially since Pre-Cat is difficult to get at. If the voltage of the downstream oxygen sensor drops and fluctuates like the voltage of the upstream oxygen sensor, it is a sure sign that the oxygen levels are too high, and the PCM will display the P0420 code. Downstream means towards where the flow ends, at the opposite end of the waterway from the source. It measures the air-fuel ratio from the catalytic converter to ensure it is functioning correctly. Its job is to monitor the oxygen content exiting the catalytic converter in order to determine if it is operating efficiently. How do I know if its my upstream or downstream O2 sensor? . These can all affect the oxygen sensors response characteristics, resulting in an extended response time or a shift in the sensor voltage curve and in the long run reduced sensor performance. LS1GTO.com is a forum community dedicated to the LS1 Pontiac GTO. 232/234 .595,.598 +2 comp cam with ported and polished stock heads with .650 lift dual springs and a bowl grind. OEM numbers are obviously different. . Is bank 1 sensor 1 before or after the cat? Could I buy universal one, if not why? Is bank 2 O2 sensor upstream or downstream? It is also exposed to extremely high temperatures, and like any component can wear over time. This cookie is set by GDPR Cookie Consent plugin. The cookie is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Performance". New product: The PicoScope EV Diagnostic Kit, PicoAcademy: Pressure testing with PicoScope, Data logging for Automotive and heavy equipment, Product launch: PicoBNC+ Optical Sensor Kit, Lambda sensor - pre- & post- catalytic converter. Check the condition of the probe element protective tube for signs of damage and contamination. 06-29-2005 08:28 PM. How do I know which oxygen sensor to replace? The regular software and driver updates are a real bonus. By clicking Accept, you consent to the use of ALL the cookies. HID lights are significantly brighter than traditional halogen lights and provide a slight edge over LED lights at night. Other than the connector, is there a difference? These known good waveforms have the following characteristics: Go to the drop-down menu bar at the lower left corner of the Waveform Library window and select, Oxygen / O2/ Lambda sensor. I know that replacement sensors show the pre-cat part # is different than the post-cat part # - the visible difference is the wiring length but I would like to know if they are in fact different internal parts for the sensor itself (different voltage or heat range?). Phase I=140whp Phase II=230whp Phase III=Cant tell the clutch pedal from the brake! 2012 AUDI A6 (C7) 2.0L CAEB - PRE / POST CAT O2 OXYGEN LAMBDA PROBE SENSOR SET-2 . You must use the correct ones, whether oem with the correct length cable and plug, or the correct "universal" equivalent, that will require you to measure and splice your old plug onto it. Such information, advice and assistance provided by such persons is given in good faith and is based on the personal experience and knowledge of the individual concerned. It's been a while since I've checked into thisso hopefully, someone can back me up. Without a subpoena, voluntary compliance on the part of your Internet Service Provider, or additional records from a third party, information stored or retrieved for this purpose alone cannot usually be used to identify you. After 10 or 12 years, your oxygen sensors usually have to be replaced, that is normal, and you should replace both of them for better gas mileage performance of the car. In most cases, a vehicle with an inefficient catalytic converter will continue to run just fine. 2012 BMW 328i (F30) 2.0L N20 - PRE / POST CAT O2 OXYGEN LAMBDA PROBE SENSOR SET . Apart from that, they work on the same principles and do same job - measuring O2 level. I cant help with the torque readings (or the tech builtin above but I'll keep going) but its easy to forgot that the O2 sensor is only reporting what it's seeing and the default reaction of replacing the O2 sensor is literally just shooting the messenger. Even though both O2 sensors are four wire, heated O2 sensors, there are definitely differences that the Motronic can detect. Each vehicle may be different and require unique test Where as before 2003, they were like yours using all 4 regular. As I understand it, the pre cat voltages should swing between around 0.2v - 0.8v per second (mine appear to do that just fine) and the post cat . Analytical cookies are used to understand how visitors interact with the website. The information within is carefully checked and considered to be correct. A switching voltage on the post-cat sensor indicates that the gases are passing across the catalytic converter's ceramic monolith without being subjected to chemical change and therefore the cat requires replacing with a known good unit, providing that the pre-cat waveform is within specification. The Titania Oxygen sensor differs from the Zirconia sensor in that it is incapable of producing its own output voltage and is therefore reliant on a 5-volt supply from the vehicle's ECM. Too much fuel produces hydrocarbons and carbon monoxide. Minimize the help page. Come join the discussion about M performance, turbo kits, engine swaps, builds, modifications, classifieds, troubleshooting, maintenance, and more! If they have the same reading, then it indicates that the catalytic converter is damaged. This website uses cookies to improve your experience while you navigate through the website. Pico Technology accepts no responsibility for inaccuracies. Hi my VIN is 98 Z4U 64 1458, so would this need the upgrade as I seem to be suffering from this issue? However they often can skew the reading back to the DME. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo, http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=ET37&mospid=47720&btnr=11_2181&hg=11&fg=50&hl=3, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=21E5_u6dz0s, VerticalScope Inc., 111 Peter Street, Suite 600, Toronto, Ontario, M5V 2H1, Canada.